Foreign. Hey, welcome back to the Podcast today! We are talking with three rock stars on one very specific topic and that is how do you generate more listings this year than you've ever listed before in your life? Uh, to help me do that, ladies first. Lisa Quick introduction and goal for listings taken this year as the as the One team leader Rockstar amongst the marketeers in the room So Lisa Chanotti Boston Massachusetts And our goal is 500 listings taken and sold this year. Okay, so 500 listings taken and sold this year and this is a product we've been working on since last.

August So we're we'll delve into some of that. Yeah, uh. Jason You've been on the show many times. Yes, Anything you want to say about yourself before we jump into this: I think I'm very privileged to be in this group of people and I'm excited about the topic and I'll leave it at that.

I Love it! Jimmy Mackin Yes sir. First time on the show. appreciate it. thank you so much! Uh Jimmy for you know the the some of the people out there in my ecosystem that don't know who you are.

Yeah, give them a little back story, tell them the company you started Sure, just said they understand and then we'll jump into all this fun stuff. Yeah, so my name is Jimmy Mackin I'm the CEO of curator. Give me back In one word, no, let's see it's hyphenated. yeah Curator: CEO So uh, we work with about 540 of the top teams in the country.

Yeah, they sell about 30 billion dollars a year in real estate and so what we try to do at Curator is just distill down those ideas and actually execute them for clients to help them get results. And as you and I both know you and I've been obsessed with this idea about how do we help take these ideas and bring them to Market to actually get more listings, right? Yeah, what are the best strategies? The best tactics. The best idea is to get more listings. So we've been a listing Center company for a long time now.

We're like a listing obsessed company at this point. I Love that me too I Think you are as well. Yes, you can give me a little, you can give me a little fist Mount there. I Was going to say we'll explain that later.

Okay, so so let's just talk about what's hot and what's not right now and listening attraction, right? So Coach's perspective. Yeah, you know marketing. You know, marketing machine perspective. You know in the trenches.

Every single day you know one of the true great operators and and sort of data-driven listing attraction and all things marketing attraction. So uh, Lisa everything goes here. What is working right now from a listing attraction standpoint. So Google pay-per-click advertising is probably one of the biggest.

Expireds are huge right now, farming is coming into play and then honestly we're doing a lot of work in our database which is having huge results. So the old leads that we generated 2017 and 2018 are where we're seeing the biggest turnover. So what's interesting is when you talk to most people that that order is going to be reversed and I think we're both on the same page and I want you to unpack the first one because the the thing that I want you to be considering is you're listening or watching. This is the obvious choices of course your past clients in sphere right? A natural easier way for the vast majority of people to go out and attract listings.

What we are in discussion now is is what is the largest addressable market and how can I serve that market? So in marketing we call it the Tam the total addressable market. So we believe that if you look at what Zillow does and Redfin does and every other major company trying to attract opportunities they're all using Google We decided we should be doing the same thing so unpack Lisa Give us give us like the person has no idea what you're talking about. Step one, two three four and the findings Totally so. We're starting with a landing page.

That is just it's so. it's not branded real estate. It is totally branded to just find out what the value of your home is. So actually no branding at all right? The whole purpose is type in your address, will tell you instantaneously.

An online valuation that lead comes in gets sent into our database. Okay, so backup. What are some of the headlines And let's all play on this because the first thing somebody's gonna say is okay. so if I'm going to run a Google ad, what is the offer? What is the question? What should I be asking that's going to cause them to click on this versus something else? Yep, so so all of us? what have we found? Well, just one one quick Pro tip on this, You know we had an opportunity to interview a guy named Larry Kim who is the founder of Word Stream.

Yes, and yeah. just a super weird dude, but also incredibly intelligent. Yeah, and one of the things he taught us in that interview he said, you know most people when they run any type of Google ad, they'll try to match the keyword right? So the map, the keyword will match. And the idea is is that if someone searches for let's say sell my house, you want to have Sell My House in the headline.

The reality is though is everyone else does the exact same thing. Bingo. So what he goes for is he calls it the Unicorn tactic which is like something entirely different. So even though the keyword may or may not match something just outrageously different than what every other ads running, so what I would encourage people to do, especially when it comes to Google ads, is like using some of the current conversations the relevant data that's happening right now in the ad copy.

So as an example, if someone's saying Hey I want to sell my hours, you might say like right now you might say something along the lines of you know last week 135 people in Stoughton Massachusetts decided to sell their house learn more here as an example Yeah, that's something that just stands out amongst the CEO of sell my house for this or get a zestimate here. So it's interesting you say that my buddy Dan Williams who I need to introduce you to you've met Dan before you've met Dan he he before he became the chief Revenue officer with three-day blinds. He was working basically at an ad agency doing all their digital including for a little company called Zillow as a startup which was fantastic but he said I look for not the unicorn but the pink tie and I said what's the pink tie and he said the pink tie is if all the keywords let's just say there's 10 000 people searching for this one and there's 7 000 searching for this one and there's three thousand six of this one and there's 1200 search for this and there's 800 searching for this one. He goes I want the one that they're at 800.

he goes I'm gonna do all of them yeah but I'm going to do the smallest possible one. So when he was running this men's retail store, yeah, he people would type in, need a pink tie and then ended up buying. you know, three thousand dollars for the clothes because the first thing they did was a big tie, right? right? So so so Specificity equals intent, exactly. And that's and that's what he's tapping into.

The more specific you can get, the higher likelihood that person's gonna be interested in what you're offering. Yeah, so I think good. So that's why I think in this case, you got to do two different campaigns or two different ad groups if we're gonna be technical about. Google one of them is the key word she's going after.

which is your your bread and butter. Keywords: What's my home worth? Home valuation? Uh, Home calculator has been really or anything. Using the word calculator has been an interesting keyword. To add to it, people look at mortgage calculators and they look at things along those lines.

So in the same vein of it, a home value calculator that term has been pretty interesting and some of the clients I have who are running these campaigns. Oh thank you, thank you. But so far Jimmy's got the cookie all right. at least I'm on the board.

uh I think what you're saying is interesting about uh Larry's insight as well. I would make it a second ad group, but I think almost a step removed and even more of the question of the problem of research They may not go searching for what's my home worth, They may search things like has the market gone down Have I Lost value of my home? Yeah, or sort of set a step removed. Problems? Yeah, the opposite. The problem: I Love that one of our big ones is Equity.

The word Equity is having big draw for us right now. Yeah, um, just kind of. What do you think? the intent is there? That's a point I think it's actually a really useful Point here? Have you? yeah? Do you have any sort of Downstream conversation? Uh Insight around why Equity? Uh, I'm gonna guess. it's again.

The messaging in the market is that values are decreasing and when a consumer hears that the value is decreasing, that's not as impactful as how much do I actually have left. Yeah, may I Also ask who is? Do you have a specific like demographic or are there particular people are there Boomers Who's actually coming to the plate and filling out the forms? Is there a one that's more known than the others? So Boomers we're doing some keywords that tie into Boomers more specifically. so we're getting more of those. but we've got probably four different campaigns going to your point.

All kind of hitting across different areas so that we're pulling in as much as we can. Because what we're finding you know is that it's not just those. Boomers we're actually getting appointments and signing listings. Yeah, from people that we wouldn't necessarily think of, we're finding condos or being or kind of hitting that pain Point More so than that.

First time buyer that bought a single family. so first time buyers who bought condos. Definitely willing to make the move up into a single family more so than the single family to the bigger single family. which that's a great insight for one of the postcards you sent me.

Five reasons why people are selling condos in this building: number four will shock you, right? Do you see that postcard? It was delicious. Yeah, Okay, well I think I get delicious I Think that's warranted? Yes, well, building on the idea of advertising staying on the track of advertising for a second. One of the things one of the themes that I'm really bullish on and this is something that I think very few people are talking about and this is going to be a little uncomfortable for the audience is watching on the replay. But there's a website called Foreplay dot Co so just make sure it's worth it.

Not.com just to be clear. dot Co Yeah and what? what that website does is an aggregate of all the best agency ad agencies in the world who are saving Tick Tock Ads saving Facebook ads saving Instagram ads and you can sort of Stack ranks them. So as a marketer like we are, what you're looking for is you're trying to find inspiration outside of the real estate industry. But most importantly, this is the key.

Point Here is, if you're in the business of advertising and marketing and you have to get not just a click or an impression review, but a sale, your ads are fundamentally going to be different than the competition. So building on your idea of using Google using search when we get into the world of display right advertising. Yeah, there's just this sort of open window for us. a sort of white space in the market where if we start running these types of ads taking the same kind of Concepts that are working so well for you in Google and apply them with some video direct response ads like there's magic there and someone's going to crack that code this year.

Yes, that's a good one. Could be our little 1200 listing. Mastermind So take us back to Uh, so you started saying I'm running ads and they're filling out a form of some kind. Yep, and then they're automatically getting evaluation Fifty percent of the time they do.

Fifty percent of the time they don't so it depends on how far down the process they go and how much info they give. Um, so it probably is really a 50 50 split so like help me understand. So I don't know what you mean. So what? What Information unlocks price.

What information does an unlock price like? So address starts and it it's kind of tiered. Capture: So address, email address, phone number, valuation given right? So got it. We're finding that it's probably about 50 of the leads come in with address, phone number sorry, address, Email 50 are coming through completely full address email phone number right? Yeah, Do you have a like if they stop? Is there is there an unlock your valuation headline somewhere? You know what I mean Like you know or like like required not required like required cell phone Do I really need their email I Really want their cell phone? Yeah that would be interesting. Just I would be interesting just to test because you can go from 50 to.

let's just say you're getting a hundred of these a week if I can get you know 200 a week based upon the formula which you're going to share in a minute. right? right? You know Again, it's it's geometric growth, but it's also stacking layers upon layers upon layers upon layers of future potential sellers into your database. and that's the real game which we're gonna get to, right? Yeah, I Guess the the upside is that as long as they enter an address, it enters the database and we can leverage Va's to go back and find the phone numbers and the email addresses associated with those addresses. So we're still catching.

I Do like your point that we might be able to just a little bit more. Yeah, yeah, just to unlock, You know? Yeah, just out of curiosity. When you I think capture the address, what do you typically do with that? Yeah, So if we get just the address, it dumps into a different bucket in our CRM and that bucket is worked by our VA team in the Philippines and they're going back, finding the phone number, finding any information that we can. Yeah often it's a list of four or five phone numbers.

They're entering those phone numbers into the CRM and then moving it into a different bucket that then goes to the inside sales team to try all those different numbers. If they're successful, the inside sales team keeps it, puts it into a nurture. Cadence If not the VA teams or the ISA team sends it back to the VA team to see if we can find some different paths. If VA team can't come come up with anything else.

Yeah, then we take it and we move it to the agent pond so that the agents can door knock it, direct mail it, and do some extra work with it. From that perspective, you're a logistics company very much Very. I said most data driven operator you're gonna So so let me ask you a question. actually I'm gonna I'm gonna say it to Lisa but then I want you to help with this the three things.

So yesterday we were interviewing Phil Jones and we're talking about you know, video at the highest level to bring people into the funnel and then throughout the process and one of the things we talked about yesterday was so what do you do with the person that unsubscribes or what do you do with the person that gives you partial information we talked about. you know, sending them uh, you know, like a personal video or that would be the most like hey Jimmy thank you so much I'm Tom Ferry Banana Real Estate. You know you took the time to fill out your address and I just I just wanted to acknowledge people that do that generally are like one of three people and I'm just curious. You know which one are you and there's there's no right or wrong one is, you know you're just kind of playing around the internet.

You thought, yeah, it'd be kind of cool to find out the value of my house and that's totally fine. or number two, you were like, well, you know, like I'm kind of just playing around on the market I'm interested I Want to know what's happening in the neighborhood and then number three is there's a legitimate chance that you're gonna put your home on the market in the next 12 18, 24 months and and each one of those is going going to present a different valuation in terms of what it is you most want? So would you just take a minute and just text me. Is it a You're just playing around B It's this: C You're thinking about that. Just text me at 949-55-1212 Just let me know which one it is so we make sure that we give you exactly what you need.

Yeah. Video sent. That's genius I'm We're not doing that. Um, we are.

Lisa Just told me I'm a genius I Have entered the cookie category. If you were only watching this audio, you need to race over to YouTube I Don't think this should be published for free? That's how good this is already. Okay So let's go back into your funnel. So they they fill out a form.

you'd scrub it through the Philippines group, then it gets turned over I'm assuming to the ISA Department that was if it was partial right? If it comes in with the phone number, it automatically goes to ISA How fast seconds. Uh, so it hits immediately to the inside sales team. the if it's seven days a week between 9 A.M and 7 P.M they're called within five minutes. Um, and we're dumping them.

One of the things that we decided to do in this case it's a little bit different than what we do on the buyer side is that all of these are going into uh, one account within the CRM that are worked by all of the listing isas. So right now there's two and a half that focus on listings. It's got a generic name so that everybody calls it Sam Right Male or female doesn't really matter. Um, so that the speed to lead is there.

And so that as we're working through on the touches and the Cadence and knowing that these could take two years for sure and the turnover and inside sales is shorter than two years, everyone's name Sam Everyone is named Sam in perpetuity. So they get called right away, right? We did find it. This was what's the what's the script Before you tell me the findings. Ring Ring Ring Hello Hey Tom this is Lisa No, you're Sam ring ring ring hello.

So we actually I know they're not using the name of the company because the Consumer Landing page doesn't doesn't have a brand exactly. Yeah, Um, and so they're just. that's why I want people to hear this that I don't want them calling and saying hey, is it in the ABC Realty your favorite real estate agent? Who are you? Why are you calling right? Did Zillow send my name to say you know like that's what that's what goes through Yeah, right. So so how help us understand? Well, and so there's a couple different paths, right? And the script depends on whether the full valuation was given, whether no valuation was given, and whether we only had partial contact information because the consumer expectation is going to be different on all three of those categories.

So if the valuation was given, Sam is calling and asking what they thought about the valuation. Did they have a chance to fully review it? Did it make sense, right? If you have any questions about that, then that's where it goes. From there, it's it. Maybe it's instinctive or maybe it's planned Lisa But this is a really important point for the audience, which is the goal of the first conversation is to earn the right for a second 100 and people just treat it as if I got one shot with this person.

So I'm going to jam it down their throat in hopes of converting them to a customer. which is it creates the exact opposite outcome you're looking. So you're saying this is not a Tinder lead. Okay, this is more like it's just lunch.

It's not even lunch. it's coffee, exactly. I'm just trying to give a contrasting experience. Um, and so the first call for that one the value was given was really just to kind of start to introduce ourselves and ask questions.

right? If there are no questions or they say I'm not interested or whatever our job is just to keep going and the inside sales team is is scripted to get through four no's before they kind of really take it and that's super important. Why is that important? Why? Like, why? why can't I just say no I'm not interested in this time. Well, the analogy of going you gave it the other day going in suit shopping, right? We know that they wanted to know their value for a reason, right? And it's until you get that no like that you're gonna get the true open, honest answer about it. And so our job is to prove that we're not just gonna ask about the appointment, about the sale or whatever.

it's the reminder that everybody's in it for themselves and nobody wants to be closed, right? Nobody wants to be close like you know, just help me out like hi, hey, uh, can I help you no I'm just looking and then you walk over and pick up a suit and try it on. you're not looking but like most most people take the not looking and then they push them away right? We know in this game is it's going to be 99 of the listings that get converted are happening in month five, seven nine. but if you have 2500, 2, 000, 3, 000, 4, 000, 5 000 of them built up over time at such a low cost which we have to talk about right? Playing the long game with one source this is I would give you a second one but Jason you know might be offended. So so that's mine.

Okay, we went add we went form fell out, we went option one, two, three, I threw in a video right obviously reminded to hey, These people aren't looking to be closed, you were trying to earn the second conversation right. Different variations of where we should be running. that or not, where we should be running that, but how we should be running it based upon where are they you know, the pink tie. The Unicorn different filing conversations give us the numbers right now.

What were your early findings? Because you really started this in. October we're sitting there in early February as this is being filmed. Yep, give us some early data. Um, so what we've been finding the month of January alone was kind of crazy.

So January our cost per lead was running at just under five dollars per lead. Um, and that of the the numbers that come to mind are the ones that we had texted about a couple of weeks ago. Is that a folate or a partial leader? Both those are partial. There's no sorry, that's the full.

It goes down to sub four dollars if we put in all the partials and include it. Um, so in that period, the first I think it was three weeks of January When we looked at it, we had 238 full leads, didn't count any of the partials, and we booked four appointments off of those. out of those four appointments, one went to a listing right away, one went to a comeback, two were sitting in the it's probably more like six to 12 months out, but it started the relationship right. Which is the biggest part.

Like so I look at those as we'll get one of those. So somebody figure out really fast. What's 238 times five? Anybody? That would be a thousand times Five times Thirty Eight, right? Thousand One Five. He's gonna beat you.

It's like yeah, 1185 or something like that. That's great. Okay, so all right. so just really fast.

Okay, now now actually there we go. Obviously it's 1190. Yeah, So here's my question for them: Would you would you spend 1190 to generate a listing all day? Answers like you know we're talking cat here. Yeah, right.

Cost to acquire a client, but cost to acquire a client? CAC Yeah, Don't miss that point though. You're you're paying 1100. Acquire the first listing the first listing. How many more in the pipeline? But I think we need to unpack though? There's there's the other costs.

because like the acquisition marketing cost sure was 238 plus the cost of the Isas, right? right? Plus the cost of whoever's setting up the ads. Yeah, so so let's just say the cost was 5 000 bucks for the one, right? Like a fully baked right? Maybe not even including your GNA fully baked all-in marketing Services Cost: Five thousand bucks to get a listing 238 from one. You've been on two appointments, You got two more coming in, and that's the first four Right out of 238 before you bring in 238 the next month before you bring in 400 the next month. Because now we're getting to the spring Market before you get 500 The next month Does everybody get The Compound Effect Here and then all of a sudden.

So how how much? Manpower That's a funny way to describe it. but I think you know what I mean Yeah, uh, how many how many Sams are required in order to future pays this out? Manage effectively, nurture, effectively, build relationships effectively with what could end up being 10 000 hand raisers by the end of the year? Have you gone through that? We're starting to kind of bake it out. and I think it's as we look at how many are actually going to keep resulting in conversations and where the nurture stays. Right now, we have two and a half Sam's I'm gonna guess that I'm probably gonna end up around seven Sams That's my gut.

Yep, it could be closer to ten. Yeah, how's how's your ad spend going? Is Google absorbing your budget or are you throwing money at it? They just can't There's not enough search volume. There's not enough search volume. Um, and that's been part of going down to the pink Tie or what was the word you used for the Jordan corn? Yeah, you wanted the Unicorn Yes, yeah.

and so part of what we're trying to do to to generate more opportunities to get because I know if we can get them, there's always going to be somebody in there that's going to sell right? and we are doing the right things once we get them in to find them. So if I can just keep finding them, I'm golden. Um, so part of the process of the unicorns and the pink ties is to spend the rest of the budget right now in the the ad spend that we've allocated. we're not even hitting 30 of what I would spend right.

and this is just not there. Yeah, right? DJ and Lindsay have the same exact problem. They're like we can't spend enough, right? Listen, when you're saying things like I can't spend enough Yeah, that means there's profit behind this. Well, but I I think yeah, yeah, but your thinking is right because you're going after I would presume more the general types of keywords in terms of intent that are really indicative of a home valuation or that kind of thing, right? Jimmy's Point super valid and I think you're already moving there too because there's got to be search volume in your Marketplace that you're not getting.

That's the it's finding it ties. That's where it really comes in. They're like, you know, how do I improve my home's value? You know? yeah? How do I update my backyard? You know, five easy ways to you know like you: I think it's all that's stuff. It's what does somebody do before they start saying what's my homework.

They may have done it out here. Sure, and then like, okay, well, but if I do this this, and this and if you can capture them in this area, that may be the more things that that lone deep with loan. Depot Home Depot Or you know the those companies are now spending money trying to get them in to say come buy your wood from us and your work lines and your shutters or whatever else we're trying a slightly different kind of build out with that with building out uh like uh, ebook content and instead of going to the home valuation landing page I Got something for the group here because this is actually a fantastic point which is when you can't spend enough money at the bottom of the funnel and you have to move up the funnel, you have to start using content you have to use using videos, right? And you have to get in the mind of the consumer, what? What's the seller looking for? At this particular stage in the process, most sellers more than 60 of sellers are actually going to sell and then buy their next house. So a lot of sellers masquerade as buyers.

Yes, and so this is one of the things that I think agents right now can. Embrace which is one of the most popular articles we produced in the last 12 months was a 3.28 million dollar sale in Raleigh North Carolina We spent a hundred dollars on the ad. It got over 7 000 visits to the website. So by creating content about let's say recent sales notable sales homes I've never sold before homes that have broken first time in the market in 22 years.

you know something remarkable. Something unique, right? Something special about that by creating that now all of a sudden you start to pull that audience in. You can start to build that audience and you need that If you're going to retarget them with direct response as or using some of these Google accounts, can we Can We just give them some examples like it's the it's the only property on the street. it's the first Like things that things that make it remarkable like it's not.

it's a three bedroom two bath you know Colonial in Georgia it has to be something special. Yeah, it would surprise you because actually I I have this uh at Elite yesterday David and I had a great opportunity to talk about the most viral content that we've seen in the last 12 months. Don't share that on this podcast. Okay, well it's going to be okay.

it's gonna be. It's send the time. Yeah, make sure there's memories with those clips. Well the thing that would jump down to us Tom was it is people are looking talking about specificity.

People are looking for things like four bedroom, three Bath under 300 000 Yep, and if you're advertising things like that all of a sudden the clicks that would normally be happening on Google you're now capturing them before they ever happen. Yeah, and so one of the things that we look for when we talk about unique and special is we you gotta get in the mind of the consumer you've like I saw earlier Lance Lambert tweeted about rates hit 5.99 right? First times we saw this since what? I guess September 12th Who who's watching this podcast right now hasn't sent that email out right? hasn't created a video or article about it I shot a green screen on it yesterday I just haven't hit publish yet. Sorry Courtney and not this, but you clean it up. but this, but the speed right? Yeah, speed is is how you win in this space.

And so when I think about content creation when I think about getting like you have to get it, you have to be tapped into. like I'll tell everyone who's watching today. Tom Very secret because I figured it out. Okay Courtney write this down this.

This might be about just this cookie. This is. This is the secret too. Well, this is the secret, it's not.

It's not quite all the way over. Okay, all right, this is the secret to why Tom Ferry is Tom fairy? Okay, I'm super excited. Before you get there, are we allowed to steal from each other? Okay, observed this working with Tom now for many years and knowing Tom for a long time Tom's superpower is his inputs. It is the thing that he actually consumes that makes his output so special.

So whether it's the Articles he reads, whether it's the people that he gets a chance to surround himself or there's a Twitter fee that he has, whether it's Instagram there's you know the best account he follows. He is fanatical about consuming the right information and he's able to process that information and he's able to digest it in a way that's clear and easy for the rest of us to understand. You can take that if you are a marketer, if you are an Advertiser If you're an entrepreneur. if you want to improve your outputs, you got to fix your inputs first.

And too many agents right now are watching what other agents are doing and they're not punching about their weight class. So I have to go down. Okay, so here's I Got can I double down on the word yes I Want that cookie I'm curious. The word is he's a master synthesizer.

He has the ability to take information from all over the place. The right inputs synthesized right now. I'm thinking about leaving the podcast this is actually about you guys right now. but thanks, no no.

but there's a what you're saying is true because all the stuff I'm not worthy doing ebooks or PDF downloads or anything like that. You're right that a huge fraction of sellers or buyers and they're looking for it, but just getting that lead is only a starting point and there's an economies of scale that sets in. But the way I look at it is it's kind of like I've called it the the Epitaph So to speak: the dash. Remember the poem the Dash when it comes to Legion you're born, you live, you die.

The dash is how you lived in the world of lead generation. The dash is how you nurture, you get a lead, and how you nurture. How like most the time they're surfing on Google they're clicking links. They're unbranded websites.

There's absolutely zero brand recognition at all. and so every call, every video, every Outreach your objective is the clock just started ticking and I have to make them want to work with me. Because here's what I'm up against: I Know that over 60 of all sellers are going to work with an agent they already know like and Trust Repeat Referral Business is the number one source of listings. Just because I have leads doesn't give me anything.

Thank you. I've got to have the ultimate nurture plan that makes them think it's not about the house. Yeah, it's about right now, the agent to help me get the house. It's a fantastic point.

I Think like marketers like we all are, we think in Frameworks at least I do right. And the framework that I think in when we talk about the principles of marketing and this applies specifically to sellers specifically to listings, is the first and the most important rule of marketing. And without it, you, you'll get nothing. Is you have to have attention if you don't get someone's attention.

if they don't know who you are, they can't They can't buy. Whatever it is, you have attention to action, right? Well, before we get to action, you have to build Affinity right. You have to move them from attention. You have to provide value where they actually like you.

You know we talked about this on stage yesterday. There was an Instagramer who had 2.6 million followers names Ari who went to basically promote a new apparel line. She went to sell t-shirts to her 2.6 million followers which is 2. like five more million than you And you got you know, thousands of Agents here or whatever the number is.

Help me outboarding right? He just he. First he brags me up and then he just crushes. Give me a second. Let me touch the thoughts she's got.

She's got 2.6 million followers and she could only sell 36 t-shirts. She's got attention she doesn't have Affinity they're yeah, they're they're not there to buy T-shirts Remember, they're there to be entertained by her. But if you were to sell t-shirts you'd sell a hell of a lot more than 36. Okay, exactly yeah.

And so my point is. you've got attention, you've got infinity, And then and then you can call to action. Then you get into action. What's another word for Affinity Because I Think about.

it's like maybe just in simplistic terms. we have a relationship now. Community camaraderie. We've connected.

So I love the word Affinity Sure. I love it. I'm just just trying to keep it in like the simplest terms. like you now have established trust.

Yeah, well, somehow. Maybe not as much trash as you want, but you can established trust so it's I'm aware of a lot of Brands and businesses I have no consideration for them whatsoever. or I don't have any sense of connection with them. So those are simpler words, right? But the idea is just being seen is nothing.

Okay, so let's let's go back to the list. Yeah, so what were the what Were the most viral pieces of content or best nurturing the way you described this a minute ago? Sure. Um, CNBC Put an article out recently that the consumers were searching. Uh, the search term When not? if when will the real estate market crash Yes was up 2400? Yeah.

So as soon as we heard that stat we create an article called is the Las Vegas real estate market crashing and that's it. And then the answer of course is no, it's not. Yeah, fill in the blank on any City doesn't make a difference exactly. Uh, so one out I'll give you one more example of this.

No, but but if CNBC went with when, why would you tell me the the hypothesis behind not just saying you know is versus when is the Las Vegas real estate market crashing? Yeah Uh so the the thought process behind it is we have to control the narrative. If we if we say when is the market crashing then you imply it is, you're implying that it is. And so so I Think the thing that we have lost in this industry is we've lost control of the narrative. For real estate real estate agents.

This industry we have completely lost control of the narrative. and if you follow anything that keeping current matters God Bless Steve Harney Right Like he's out control the narrative, he you've got to control the narrative. And so for us, we, we aren't trying to Simply go viral. we're trying to actually control The Narrative of that process.

Yes, yes, beautiful. So give us another one. All right. Uh, eight pros and cons of living in the Triangle.

If you live in a relocation area, you know the first step in this process is actually you know, hey, what's the best area to live in within this Market Yeah again, these are where to buy in Dallas Where to Buy in Austin Where to buy in Houston You know all that. All of that. Yeah, but but okay so as we're going through this, have you created any content on that? Do you know? Have you gone to was it Atlas The Atlas article, the Atlas Movie 48 years of where people are moving from and Alice or United I don't know which one yeah one of those two or we used to be able to go to Census Bureau does it too Yeah, how many walks.you know.gov and it would tell us people from you know Cook County Illinois are moving to this location this okay and like to go to create content and say why are people from Cook County Illinois mostly moving to Los Angeles specifically Pasadena Find out more here? Yeah and like go super narrow and don't care that there's only 47 views, Know that the 47 views are sitting somewhere in Chicago right now going get me out? Yeah elephant Chicago Just giving that as an example. But back to your point about synthesizing.

It seems like What's Happening Here Is we take current events that are impacting what consumers are thinking about sellers in particular and we give them a synthesized expert perspective? Sure, Yeah, right. Yeah, Okay, this is for the question I know you're thinking about asking. Go ahead I didn't have one. Keep going.

Keep going. Well, let's get really loud. there's there I Want I Want to build on this idea because most people are watching right now. We know they're not going to create content.

they're not going to write an article or blog. I mean maybe they'll use Chat Gbt to do so right? but I would I would? Yeah, and they're so they're looking for maybe a little bit lower hanging fruit and this. So this is an example. We're kind of building on this idea and this whole sort of shows about which is how to get listings.

One of the things we've been testing is this idea of value-based voicemails and it's been an incredibly effective strategy for us in a really small sample size. So I'll give a disclaimer because we're experimenting. But the basic idea is when you sell a house, right when you sell a house, obviously the opportunity to adjust sold campaigns right there for you. and we all understand the circle prospecting.

But before you do any of that, what you should do is you should go to your database and say I'm about to call people around this particular listing to see if anyone else is thinking about selling their property. If I come across any deals, would you like me to let you know it's a good move? And so you we're basically we're going to go to work. We might as well get something from it, even if we get nothing from it exactly. And so what we want to do with our databases, show and demonstrate the fact that we're in the market.

We're selling houses, we're talking to homeowners, and so number one, you're going to pick up, of course, buyers. I Know it's not about buyers, but you get some buyers right to help feed the team. But then you'll also find that buy sell side from people saying yeah I Would love to live in that neighborhood I Haven't sold because I got I I You know I want to live in that neighborhood specifically and now you're starting a conversation now when you pick up the phone and call the individuals what we've done at Curators. we we took one of our clients recently Connie Carlson and uh, she's in Atlanta Georgia She has fantastic home.

She sold in four days. Fifteen thousand dollars above the list price And so we said. All right, we're gonna go into Prop Stream And we love Prop Stream. Fantastic tool.

We're gonna build a list around that that home. Yeah, we're going to enrich it with something called skip Tracing which will add the phone, whatever. add the email address. We're going to load it into our call center software and we're going to call these people now.

The list was 37 people. We're not talking about 100, it's 500 Yeah, and we just say hey and the script wasn't It goes like this: We're like hey, we just wanted to give you an update. We recently sold one two Three Main Street. The reason that we're calling you right? this is important when we're leaving a voicemail is because when you when a home sells near your home, it's going to impact your value.

So even if you got no plans in selling your home, we'd love to give you a free home value. Update: Give us a call back at blank blank blank right? That that campaign right. We call 37 people. half the numbers are right, we can't get a hold of them.

We left 14 voicemails no one picked up the phone Tom one person calls back. she said yeah I want to sell my house in six months? It's worth nine hundred thousand dollars taxes. Oh yeah, my daughter went to school with her I know who she is like okay, that's an alternative 37 37 calls before smashed the cookie. What happened? That was a mic drop moment.

that one podcast over that's the thumbnail and he took the other. By the way, just um, just a send this to someone at your company that does marketing? Send it to the Chief Marketing officer. Yeah, send it to the head of marketing. Send it to you know? Sarah Who's that brilliant person who is just getting inundated with can you do my Just Listened cards and just send it to these people and just say I think if you listen to this, you could really help the organization because I know they could because these are scale plays one thousand percent.

And for the person that's listening right now who has the the big appetite thinking they're probably taking I mean I I was like hey, could you get my new path I need to start taking notes and I was like wait a minute I can just watch this over and over again before we publish it um I hope you're taking notes. Well I was gonna say I Love the home valuation offer because we've used the script before. Whenever we sell homes in an area it affects your value or Equity right? but then it's such a logical would you like to get an updated home valuation. your value changes and that one I believe can be done with or without scale.

That's like that can be a roll up your sleeves to be Sweat Equity and do the work. That's a good move and if you're afraid to make the phone calls, knock on their doors, go do it like you know Sunday afternoon from four to six and just say hey, I'm just I'm just reaching out with some good news. we just hold the house down the street. Here's the just sole prop like hand them the flyer with the sold price.

yeah and say we just wanted to let you know that you know with this happening, home prices are going up. there's just a tiny little Community We want to just let you know if you'd like evaluation on your property because it's probably different from that property. Like that face-to-face interaction on a Sunday afternoon? Beautiful! Where were we when we heard um, it may have been Schwartz Who said Sundays between like six and eight are now the highest surge time for people looking for properties? Yes and then weren't we all like, maybe we need to be making phone calls? Maybe right, sending emails, shooting content you know, like, like everything. Oh yeah, all right.

So so we talked about your number one. What was number two? Uh, was it was it geofarming demo farming? It's actually Expires Yeah! How many expired listings showed up in the Greater? Massachusetts Marketplace that you serve on December 31st January 1, 7, 000, 7, 000 Extremely high intent hand raisers? Yep, what'd you guys do with them? We started breaking them down and we're just dialing through and seven thousand is a big number. big number. so we were able to filter down and is in the month of January We've already signed four listings from expires, right? Super quick, easy.

I Think one of them is already under contract, right? Just takes a slight different strategy. Um, but we've got more that are actively in nurture. There's so much money to be found in expireds. So many people stopped doing them in 2020 2021.

Yeah, there wasn't any, right, right? Well, this is gorgeous. No No. I had a question I was gonna say do you know the ratio of homes that didn't sell in your Marketplace compared to yours prior and I'll give you the context on this I was talking to coach David Caldwell about and he did the math in his Marketplace and he realized that 30 of homes in Greater Portland where he was at didn't sell. They just don't sell.

Yeah, and not only do they not sell, they don't all come back on the market. So there's not only an opportunity for like active hot expire, but there's also the opportunity to go back and see who never came back on the market right? And there's the opportunity to start getting that word out if you're positioning for listings that 30 of homes don't sell, who you work with matters and those kinds of language patterns do you remember? Did you ever see the Josh Ruben We put together a Nine Nine postcard campaign that started like 30 to 40 days after the home and it expired and then we just once a week for nine weeks we would just we would just let them know hey, you know, Did you know that only two-thirds of the home in Portland ever actually sell when they Market We specialize in helping the one-third that didn't sell exactly and that that's not the first postcard? but it's just it was just one after another, just set on autopilot nine times. Then you start making phone calls and it's what we know in the expired game. Doing this for 34 years is everybody goes crazy for the first like 24 36 hours and then it just goes like this because in a typical real estate market which we're in now yeah, every day there's new expires and New Opportunities and most people are inconsistent So it's It's just like the slide we showed yesterday.

Eight percent closed in the first 30 days, 27 close a month, two through three, and then everybody stops. And all the real money is in what you do, playing the long-term nurture game. So so what have we found? What? What's the new equivalent of that? What's the new equivalent of the longer term nurture for expireds for expires? This is your world. I Have some ideas for unrelated expires.

We haven't gone into that. so I'd love to hear your thoughts. Yeah, I Think it's it's going to be constant communication I think that it's what does that mean like I Like I You know constant communication. It's give us an example.

It's just constant phone calls. It's updating. I Don't Which one of you said it, that the media is creating this narrative. Yeah, our biggest job is to undo the narrative, right? right? Like that's the singular Focus that we have.

Like how many people listening to this have heard the market is crashing? It's the worst time to sell, right? Interest rates are crazy. There's no more buyers left in the market, right? right? Um, and our job is to actually just keep on doing that. Especially with expires. They've been burned, right? They tried to sell most of these before the market got all wacky and they don't understand that.

It's actually not wacky. Yeah, it's just been the wrong agent with the wrong strategy and our job is to prove through consistency that we're going to be different. That's a refreshing Point Have you guys ever listed your home and had it expire I have no it was awesome how many I mean it's a property? We we were flirting with the market and the listing agent is like a really dear friend. Knew we were flirting with the market but it was the same thing.

but I had another one that was in 2008 that I bought like this shitty condo right because a friend of mine was doing condo conversions and I was like sure okay I'll throw a little money at it like whatever and I knew the market was already crashed. Sure I thought in 2008 but by the time it was 2010 it was worth all of my Equity was gone and then some and I remember like just somebody just put that thing on the market like I don't even care what it's worth and it was interesting. my high-end one. no one called now they may have gone like this into the Emma said oh let's Tom Ferry like I'm not calling that guy right right now.

sorry if that person I might I guess I don't apologize for cursing on my podcast. um but the other one was I got hit non-stop because it was just in an LLC name. There was no association in my name right? So that one just got like they tracked it down, they figured it out and just you know, like oh yeah it was. It was pretty interesting.

but when you think about like your home expiring, you know if I actually wanted to sell that house and I was really like we were moving. um that would be a horrible experience. How do we have more empathy for the person even if they were like me that was just flirting with the market. Um, how do we have more empathy for the person that really got burned? Yeah, yeah, that's the biggest play right? Phil Jones says uh, content without context is noise so you see context and the best way to do that is asking the right questions, right? trying to learn what were they looking to do.

What do they want to accomplish What stopped them? Yeah. and I think what you said like you started by saying we call them constantly and I think a lot of people might hear that through the lens of oh hard hardcore but then you start talking about what you're actually doing. You're helping to try to unpack The Narrative and help them understand what's really happening and it's all being done through the lens of how can we add value to you, right? Service over sales? Yeah, the Mantra that we live by. We provide service, deliver value.

The sale will come. One of the most important lessons that Phil taught me when we co-wrote that book. Exactly what to say for real estate agents. This concept of show.

Show me that you know me. Show me that you know me and as a marketer, there was a big unlock for me at that time and that the unlock is okay. If you're going to Market to show empathy, you have to join the conversations happening in their head. And so as an example, talking about expireds, we had this campaign that we ran.

generator for 4.4 Million Dollar Listing actually Peggy Lynn Speicher who's at his conference uh, we work with her curator. uh we. We use this angle that you could use for expired. You could use it for people who are doing just just regular resale.

and I'm just going to read this for the audience because I think it actually Taps into what everyone's talking about. It says there are 2 000 realtors in Maui but only a few that are brave enough to tell you the truth. So right out of the gates we're like trying to capture their attention. This is not about the market, we're trying to do some storytelling.

The real estate Gold Rush is over, but this might surprise you. Just last month, 146 people bought a home on Maui and so I'll just stop there. What we're if you're going to Market to an expired what I would say if I were to translate that for an expired I might say something like hey, we know the experience that you just went through is about as bad as it gets with selling your house. but hold on a minute.

they're it. They're actually in the market. They're actually right is Hope We've got a plan right? Something along that like I Agree. Build on that like get in their minds so acknowledge what they went through.

Ignore if you don't acknowledge it, they're going to say this person has no idea and they're just using me. They're just using me. Exactly. It's so interesting I think we all need to be thinking about again.

I'm gonna go back to we're all saying the same thing. Sure, it's know your customer know their pain points and then can you be courageous enough to say Jimmy I'm sorry it didn't sell um I'm sorry I didn't bring you a buyer Yeah, I'm just letting you know that in the last four you know, whatever. like just like and that's not the script Sure, but but that's the tone. The tone isn't hey I'm sure you figured out that you're yes, you're the 47th person that's called me this morning and I'm not even sure why I answered at this point like it's also not sounding like everybody else.

It could be the Ofq. Yeah, it could be the hey because you put your home on the market in July of last year. You know fact, fact, Fact: Yeah. Rate increased Market You know Marketer? you know war in Russia So I don't have to tell you right? I'm just letting you know if you're interested.

there's another way. Yes, and that's even horrible. But we're just role-playing This is by the way, how you figure out you just throw it and throw it and then say what do you think and how do we make it better and you know what I mean 100 yeah I think one of the keys that we're finding and it's almost like this. Actually, no, both of mine go away for how bad that roleplay is.

Uh, one of the keys is not to talk about the other agent. Did Apple ever mention Samsung right? right? It's like you, just if you go, you go down that road. It's only only leaves one pound correct. but it's super easy when you're talking about.

We know your experience was bad, we know it didn't work out. Sure to say because you didn't have the best pictures and because your agent didn't do right I did it I Just did an analysis of like five things that that you might be interested. You know if you decide to put your home on the market next time, just please make sure your agent does these five things right. I'll send you.

just give me an email I'll send you the list. Yeah, Yep, yeah and let's and let's keep building on this idea of like talking to the consumers like they're not morons, like they're actual human beings, right? right? And this is. it's an old Dave David Ogilvy Quo right? The rule number one in advertising the consumer is not A And if you're watching the best book on Advertising I think it's required reading is on Advertising right? It's been around forever. I think I have a signed copy at my office it's not signed to Tom it was.

You know it's like signed to somebody else ounce. Take it, take it. Yeah. Um.

So so one of the things that we all know is that the term Zillow is search more than the term real estate. And so consumers. When you own a house, you're checking your zestimate. You're checking your red fin estimate.

Whatever. That is. One of the things that we've done from a nurture perspective, an engagement perspective with seller leads and or people in our sphere of influence is we use the Zestimate to our benefit and so I'll give the audience here kind of a quick script. On this.

the subject line would say your Zestimate is dot dot dot hi Tom I Was on Zillow earlier today looking at a few properties in your neighborhood and I thought I thought I'd check out yours. Estimate the estimate for your home's values 202 million, Seven hundred thousand dollars and we actually include a screenshot of the Zestimate right? 100 I Have my opinion but I'd love to hear yours. What do you think and all we're doing at this point and we use this accurate. It's a fantastic script just to start a conversation, just to engage them, just to actually be in their sort of orbit as a potential.

How good is this? It's really good for every person you sold a house to 2019 2020 2021 Hey I was thinking about you today. Yeah and just for fun I went on Zillow and I looked at what this estimate said. I have my opinion on the price. What do you think? Bam that like that's the that's the fastest CMA a day you could do on that I think you could do it as a text that is almost there.

It is all right, right? Crown Jewel that's the cookie so you notice again, she's going back to Um. so I love the foreplay.c I'm gonna play around I'll say but I'm also thinking about Quora and I was thinking about if I went to Quora or another sort of you know way to mine. What's going on in the minds of consumers? um, or or you know, um, what's what's the other movie we're playing around with? Um, it's the consumer site that gives you the word tree of every possible question that they're asking. Answer the public, Answer the public right.

So answer the public which I'd love or Quora and I'd be searching for why my home didn't sell or bad experiences with real estate agents. You could also use like Buzzsumo and start mining what's going on in social media Realms I Love it and did everything tell somebody to tell the con the person listening right now why we ought to look at those three sites and why we want to look at those things because content without context is noise. Speak directly to what they're saying. What's in the mind of consumers not? you have to understand I'm a really good real estate agent I could sell your home.

At the last age, it was a knucklehead Yeah, like you have to understand what am I responding to what is the What is the I've often told my clients that an objection is an objective what's the real objective in terms of what they're looking for. And to get that, you have to understand what they went up against, what the problems are, what they're trying to solve for. yeah. And to get that, you have to ask questions to learn what they care about.

Conducting research on a macro level on sites like what you just mentioned makes a world of sense because a it gives you context B it's going to give you ideas. The other thing we're not talking about with expireds is I think most of us look at expires for instance as oh, I'm going to cold call them oh I'm going to door knock them yeah But the marketing applications like. We have a lot of our clients in the ecosystem who make a lot of video? Yeah, right. And they're sharing videos where they're saying, you know I Went on an appointment last week.

yeah with somebody whose home was on the market it didn't sell. And here are the immediate three things that stood out about What's stopping homes from selling right now. It was a piece of content that was for anybody to watch. Yeah, but what they're seeing is all their friends who know of their friend who's on the market and their suffering and their homes not selling.

and they're not even expired yet. But they're about to be. They're sharing those videos and this person's already getting the oh, they get me yeah that they understand yeah. do you think you guys ever see if you see the Lisa Doyle expired listing video I think I've seen it.

but it's so fuzzy in my mind 12 years ago ish, right? Like I said okay guys, we're like we're on. We're on a conference call. Yeah, you get the timing here. All right, everybody.

here's the challenge: I Want you to create one video that you believe could get you 10, 15, 20 transactions in the next 12 months. Whoever has the best video Go! So I So again, the Lisa video is Lisa with no microphone. probably a flip video camera. More than likely more than likely And it's her hi I'm Lisa Doyle with J rocklev Realty standing in front of like 648 banana Street and she's like this home was recently on the market for six months.

they had no offers, home actually expired Greg and I listed it and we sold it for 99 of asking price and we did it in 14 days and literally remember, remember the old editing Fade to the next one yeah and they fade to the next one. Yeah, hi, it's Lisa Again, this is one two four, you know Banana Street out This one was on the market with three different agents for more than a year and a half. Greg and I relisted the home we repackaged, we repositioned. yeah, she did seven of these in a row.

Yeah, so she was like, well, I'm just gonna put them on DVDs and mail them to people I'm like, well, that actually could work again. think of the time, but she ended up emailing that as a YouTube laying down once she made a connection, right? and that was just her way of like, hey, take a look at all these other things and here's just an example of what we do. Yeah, and the person just went like this seven times in a row. This woman knows how to repackage, reposition.

Shout out to Lisa Doyle and it was so not polished, not professional, not perfect. It was perfect for the time. It was user generated content before use generated content and it was. It's so so.

what's the new version of that When we think about what's on the minds of consumers, what are you thinking about? Well the first thing that comes to mind to to your point is that we always have to take away our perception of what's on the mind of the consumer right? And that's the first thing that with why the research right? Because as agents even myself right I get into this mindset of I think that this is what their pain point is going to be or why they're frustrated and making the content yeah under our our lens is dangerous. Yes um so where to go with that? It's a lot to think about I'm not quite sure but I there's a strategy and a plan that can be put together. It's can I speak to every new agent on the planet right now. Absolutely so.

the scal uh Liz Novello we're texting back and forth and she says okay my brother says I should be doing a lot of content I'm like you should I said you want to get really good really fast she goes yeah I said I want you to call every expired listing in your market and I want you just to survey him yes and she was like okay tell me why and I said because if you understand the pain points of people that try to put their home in the market that didn't sell the next time your friend says how's the market or how's it going you could say you know it's interesting I Just called 197 people that tried to put their home in the market in the last 12 months and it didn't work out and what identified was there was five reasons that the home didn't sell. You just shut up. What's everybody to say? Well what were they right and I've given that advice to so many new agents and again it's instead of trying to get a listing which is what most real estate companies will. If they if they're gonna lean towards expires, they're going to say call the expireds So every new agent, every n