Hey, so welcome back to the podcast today! I Am super excited to expose you to Queenland Queensland Australia's number one agent the last few years. absolutely dominating in his marketplace right now his name is Alex Jordan at McGraw an amazing company and Alex all I want to start with is just welcome to the show man, we made it! Oh thank you! Tom It's a privilege and honor to be with you. So Alex for the people that maybe have never heard of you or don't know who you are yet, but now lots of people are going to know who you are, give them just a little bit of background, how long you've been selling houses, what got you into this industry and maybe some context for what your business looks like today? Sure! So I started in this industry in 1999 23 years ago and I struggled for the first 10 or 12 years of my career. Not that I had the wrong intentions I had intentions of being successful but I didn't have a process I didn't have consistency I really didn't have a vision on how to get to where I needed to be so it was a difficult start and I almost gave up in 2011 I Wanted to leave this business because it got to a point where I was just unable to to make a living hella got into the industry was somewhat coincidental, you know I don't I Don't know many people that aspired to be an agent when they're studying in school. You know your parents are sort of trying to get you into a different profession in in most cases, yeah. But for me I was at a point in in life where I was a musician I was doing some gigs around the city making very little money, struggling financially, and I was looking for a job that would pay me during the day so I could continue my music career and that's what prompted me to look into real estate and that was in 1999. So that's 23 years ago. so it's been a while, but it's been a bumpy ride for me. Tom and that's something that I think is important to to I Guess take into account if agents have been doing this for five or six or seven years and they haven't had the success I Don't think that means they won't be successful because for me, it took a long time to get a breakthrough into into getting good numbers. So Alex I So appreciate that perspective and certainly for the person that's listening right now. Whether you're a veteran, been selling houses for 20 30, 40 years, or you're a brand new agent, it is a breath of fresh air to hear that the number one agent is. Marketplace Got there after 11 years of struggling. so so I'm curious before we really get into the meat of what I want to discuss on the show. What was it at Year 11 when you said process? What was it that you finally like it? It clicked and what happened? Yeah. so Tom I think In this industry, there are two types of agents that are successful or can be successful. That's two paths that you can take. One is you're a geographic specialist, so an area specialist a community specialist which I think is the most effective way of building an attraction business. The alternative is you're a product specialist so you might sell Prestige homes or waterfront apartments or whatever your Niche is. But it's important to have a specialty and expose yourself to the market in that way because ultimately I've discovered that whatever you put out there on your profile, your digital profile, your social profile, whatever you put out there is more or less your resume and the consumer that's looking at you and studying you. You will attract similar business to what you're currently performing. So if you're doing low-end products, badly presented homes, not staged, low quality photography, chances are you're going to attract a similar client and the one ones that have the better hunts aren't going to come to you. So for me, for 11 or 12 years, I was I would what I would call a transactional business I would do letterbox drops I would get a call I'd do an appraisal I'd get a listing I'd sell it and then it's back to square one. It was this continuous grind which never really built any momentum. I've had to reimagine myself and somewhat reinvent myself and when I joined McGrath I realized that I was trying to capture too big of an area. The biggest change in my career that was a breakthrough moment for me was going from 20 000 homes which I was targeting but inconsistently with low quality content not done frequently and I had to reinvent that and I went from 20 000 properties down to 770. it was a big call and it was psychologically difficult to do, but that enabled me to be very consistent, very focused on the area I became hyper knowledgeable about every home in that little pocket I was very frequently with my delivery of material, letterbox drops, calls, and I started to get market share in that very small patch and it got to about 70 market share at its peak. And then I realized okay, now that I've got this really well structured attraction business where the consumer is calling me, asking for me to come to their home, I can scale this same business model and expand it geographically in neighboring suburbs. So the biggest change in my career was I Guess building a brand of my name that was really important, using Digital Social to get visibility and really narrowing down my focus geographically until I was dominant and then once I had dominant Market check I then expanded with a similar business model so you know you're speaking my love language because I am the biggest fan of Niche right? Like become the expert of something and then it's easier to expand from there. But when you are a generalist, it's very hard in this business. So so that was a beautiful answer. Alex What? I Want to unpack today talking with John who's a you know mutual friend of ours the CEO of McGraw He said what makes this guy so special is four things: his mindset, his processes and we were kind of jumping into it right there. um, his unique factors was the way he described it. like the reasons why people pick Alex and he said Alex has a way of articulating it that other agents could emulate, could borrow or could find in themselves their own. And then the last one is just how you've organized your business to be able to manage the kind of transactions you're doing. So So talk to us first about mindset. What have you done to go from the early days of struggling to now being who you are and what was the biggest, what was the biggest transition or lesson learned along the way to gain this mindset? Yeah, any interesting question Tom Um, for me: I hit a brick wall. So it was. It was almost as if until I hit this quick wall I wasn't going to change. And that happened in 2011 where there were floods in the city that I sell in which is Brisbane and Queensland Australia and I lost a lot of listings, a lot of sales and I was financially in a position where I had to borrow money from family so I had zero dollars I couldn't pay my rent and I wanted to leave this industry and that was a very difficult moment psychologically. But it was also a breakthrough moment that I needed to to experience at the same time in that year I had a health diagnosis of a condition which I have an autoimmune condition and the doctor said in 2011 that in 10 years time you won't be able to drive a car so you need to change your career. That was a big shock moment for me. There's a saying that uh, if I remember it correctly, the best gifts in life are badly wrapped. um and at that point if you said to me Alex what a great thing that's happened to you, just give you the opportunity to improve and be better I would have questioned you I would have said no, this is terrible you know I've got health issues I'm not going to be able to work of mum and financially a very bad position but I had to borrow money from family to pay my rent. Um, no, this is not good news but when I look back Tom that was the defining moment where I had to change the way I looked at life, the way I treated time. time became a precious commodity so there was no longer the option of just cruising and being casual. it was Alex you got 10 years. You're not going to be able to function after this so you better make a change and everything became non-negotiable There was no more laziness of I don't want to knock on that door or make that call or I'll do that tomorrow. Well, let's just leave it till next week. It was no now is that time or never or else you could have failed. You're not going to be able to provide for your family and you're going to struggle in life. So that brick wall that I hit was a defining moment of change psychologically. Where from then on I went into a different mode of operation which was Zero fear because the fear of knocking on a door or calling someone that you'd never had spoken with was a lot less fearful and damaging than not being able to function in life and losing my career. So it was at that point where I said no more casual half-assed approach. let's do this properly and that's where I had to re-look at my business, narrow down my Geographic Focus become the specialist, create a brand of myself, my name through social through digital, have more intelligent conversations, add value to every interaction that I had, and give selfless advice. You know, give people advice as if they're your family, your brother, your mother, your father. rather than give self-serving advice that was beneficial to me. And I think once that sort of mindset changed the reaction from the consumer change I was creating much stronger relationships. There was a lot of trust there and when you build trust you, you win the business and ultimately for me, this is what it's about. It's a relationship business. There was about six mic drop moments in that answer. Alex So I have to ask you. You and I both know people that have dealt with difficulty. Hit the brick wall metaphorically and they went the other direction. So why did you go that direction? You had the choice. We've seen plenty. People you know have a breakdown and not followed by a breakthrough. So so what in your past or what was in in your future? That said, I have to do this I don't think I had a better alternative Tom Um, it was either failed or or or stop being fearful and it was I had a fear of rejection I think we all do. that's really Everyone likes getting rejected. It's not a good feeling you know. So it's there was this resistance of of not wanting to be rejected. but I had to completely overcome and in the way I Coach my team is. When you make a cold call when you knock on a door, expect to get rejected. This is normal. This is expected. Don't go in with the expectation of them inviting you in or saying great thanks for calling. Alex Here's my home and let's let's let's get this underway. It's it's a process and you've got to be willing to go through those rejections. It doesn't hurt once you interpret it the right way, but if you become an emotional person I find it's hard to deal with these things and we're in it. We're in an industry. It's somewhat of a roller coaster ride. There's there's lots of ups and downs in real estate. You know one day you're at the top and then the next day you're at the bottom. and I had to really just flatten my questions And you know I want I celebrate the wins. but I don't go ridiculous when things go good if things go bad. I'm trying to be cool with it as well. but for me Tom it was I had no other alternative like what what am I going to do right? We're very blessed to be in this industry regardless of which country you're in. There's very few careers that you can come into with very little education No University degree, no real pedigree or background or anything and earn the income that some of our Us agents can earn. No other industry offers that opportunity and you can go and study to be a surgeon for 10 years and some agents are still making more than these these surveys. So so for me it was. Is there a better career path? Do I have a better option out there? I could go and earn 50 60 80k a year and have a normal nine-to-five job. but that wasn't really exciting for me because I've given this career 10 to 12 years of my time I knew the process to some degree I just haven't really given it a chance. So it was either go somewhere else and earn 80k a year or give give this my best and try and make it happen. And I chose that part I Love it I love it So I have to ask. Obviously with the autoimmune disease here, we are now 11 years since that time has passed and 12 years right? So you've clearly moved Beyond It right? You probably still deal with it I imagine. But but how do you maintain that mindset right? If you were told you had 10 years and you're now sitting at 12 and you're still able to do the things you want to do, how do you maintain that sense of fire and urgency? Well I think it's somewhat personality driven and I think your past can influence how you behave, you know I came from a very low socioeconomic background I lived in Housing Commission with with my parents for most of my life. Um, it wasn't easy I was I moved from Iran to to come to this beautiful country and I feel very grateful and blessed to be here. but for me it's way it's trying to acknowledge the opportunity that I have that gives me that drive and motivation I need to look at myself and say hey Alex you're very lucky to be here. You're living in this beautiful country, you enjoy some freedoms that your your countrymen in Iran are struggling to to to have. You've got this awesome job. You've got a beautiful area that you live in. Um, you're still walking, you're still talking, you can still see, you can still hear your function. Um, health-wise things are up and down. I've got two autoimmune diseases: I've got Crohn's disease which is a bowel issue yeah and I've got Ankylosing Spondylitis which is a spinal disease which turns the the person into a hunchback. So I am struggling with that at times but it is what it is I've got to be grateful for what I have I mean this is the hand I've been dealt I can't change that I've just got to play this game the best I Can the the worst I think I guess position to be in his self-pity and that victim mentality and and that is is such a Negative stance that will eat you up inside and we all have a reason to be a victim we can all justify. you know, self-pity but I find that that really kills the energy and the life inside of someone. So regardless of what happens to me good or bad, I need to say I'm very blessed to be where I am and very grateful to have this opportunity. And and I think I've got to acknowledge that I've got a great opportunity to take advantage of because if I don't recognize what I have a special then I probably won't utilize it as well as I could. Yes, I'm so proud of you just for your mindset and the just the emotional fortitude that you have to continue to strive to be the way you are and just the overall mindset. So it's no wonder that Johnny said to me, you got to ask him about this But let me hit you with number two. Let's talk about marketing processes but I want to I want to ask the question differently. So Alex let's assume you've been in the business for five, six, seven years and and you realize you know being a generalist is not going to get you anywhere and you're saying I'm going to take over this community or this price point or this style of home, Let's let's do let's do community because everybody can relate to that. What would you say are the first five moves to become the expert of that community and become the agent that everybody is calling and saying Alex There's a lot a lot of people in the business but we're calling you come sell our house. So Tom I Believe this industry is very profile driven. It's not just skill driven. There's a lot of Highly skilled agents that know how to do business but struggle to get opportunities. So number one is, you've got to build a profile of credibility and that's done through a layered approach. It's not just one or two tasks I Find that digital is really important. You've got to dominate digital we use. Google AdWords We use the platforms that we use in Australia to Market ourselves and our properties. Social media is a big one. Tom Because the average Facebook user logs on 14 times per day. Yes, there's no better platform to reach an audience consistently that they're not even looking for you. but you're on their feed and they can't avoid you. So first you've got to get on the shopping list of this community. The community doesn't know me so you've sent me into a new area I'm in the US they don't know who I am I've got to create some credibility and profile. It's going to take some time. It's not a one month two month approach. It's going to take several months. I Would start with doing letterbox drops consistently on a weekly or bi-weekly basis. so every one to two weeks I have a high quality letter in their letterbox, not showpony. This is really important. The tone in which we communicate to our Market I think directly governs their response. The old school cheesy way of doing real estate. It's saying I'm the best and I'm number one and look at me. I just sold all these properties and broke records. That stuff is not well received in my opinion. I Think the tone has to have some humility. The content needs to be specific to the audience. It needs to sound intelligent. So what would I do I would do I would be in your area. Let's say Tom where you live I don't know anyone there, they don't know me. So firstly, I've got to build a profile. I do that through letterbox drops through social media through Google and the content I'd be putting out is statistics that's relevant to you as a homeowner. So I would say in this area for the last 12 months, here's the top 20 sales. That's one letterbox drop. the next letterbox drop might be in. in the last 10 years, he's a chart of growth, the median value in your suburb, and you can compare that to neighboring suburbs. So I'm just going to take segments of Statistics that are easily accessible online. I'm going to put it into an intelligent format. print it on an A4 sheet and I don't do DL cards very often because I think there's an element of AD blindness. As soon as the consumer sees this glossy advertising, it goes into a different pile. So we we buy very high quality A4 paper We print in a very minimalistic, clean way and that's the sort of content I'd be sending out to my audience I'd be sending that to every consumer. Everyone in the area would receive that from me and that would be done consistently to the point where after three or four months I'll be known to that Community they'll be like who's this Alex guy he keeps on sending us this information will I be on the shopping list. Maybe because it's not just that that's going to get me there eventually I'm going to have to meet these people. We're whether I knock on their doors, whether I get their phone number and call them I've got to build a relationship and a connection with them. but I think it starts with letterbox drops with digital with social and then ultimately you start to get in the door onto their phones and the relationship build so that that's sort of the way I would structure it. And one thing that I think is really powerful if you want to build profile in this business. not many agents do this well. it's market reports. not just a one or two page report, but put together a very well structured intelligent report. I'm doing right now. that's 200 pages so it's a very detailed report I spend huge money on these things I print them professionally. they look like a coffee table, magazine or book and that I deliver to every homeowner in my area for me the profile and credibility that I build just with that market report I've been doing this for a number of years. It's above and beyond anything else I could do because straight away they pick it up, they open it up and it is at a level that it's above and beyond what any other agent does. Then straight away I've gone from not being known to being highly considered. so market reports are a big part of our business and I think that's something that agents can benefit greatly from. Alex When I see you at the Era Conference, you've got to show me one of those. So I'll bring this back for my listeners How brilliant this is. I go back to the early days of New York City Real Estate Barbara Corcoran creates the Corcoran report and it puts her and her company absolutely on the map. So Alex I've been telling my clients for the last you know, Really probably since the beginning of the pandemic that we need to be thinking differently about how we were, messaging how we were marketing, how we were being the educator only right only in this space. And one of the fun things was my client Andy C Andy took basically two of his college kids and said I need a stats major and an Econ major and basically said I will pay you if you will write a report on the last 20 years of Silicon Valley where he works right in in California and I want I want 20 years of historical data that basically explains why pricing is the way it is in our area and what was fantastic about this report? Of course. First, he's the only one in his town that's doing it. So you know what happens when you're the only one in the community that's doing it. You become the market of one. There's only one person to turn to for Andy Here's what he told me, he said Tom The punch line was after doing the assignment, the answer was as Apple stock goes up home prices go up in Silicon Valley as Apple stock goes down. That was it. But again, like you, he was the only one beautifully packaged and able to educate people. So so that was outstanding. When you when you talk about social this is I mean I was on YouTube in 2007 I was on Friendster before I was on Facebook So again you're speaking my love language. What do you find to be the most effective posts, videos, pieces of content that that really add to the credibility of your profile. There's a number of continent that I think works. Um, it's important to invest in Social You've got to pay to play. So putting out an Instagram or a Facebook or post and not boosting it, not sponsoring it isn't going to get you the reach and exposure that I think you need in this industry. so there's got to be an investment towards it to get that exposure I Find the most effective way of building your audience on social media So And I've built my audience organically. There hasn't been any sort of bought sort of followers because that stuff does not work. so I'd make sure that anyone that's looking at building their profile doesn't go and pay for followers because that really ruins the algorithm and your reach. You end up reaching nobodies and the people that matter don't don't really see your content. The most effective content that I have noticed gets me exposure following and visibility is aspirational. Home So beautiful houses, beautiful product. That is not just about me because I Think if you just focus purely on yourself the entire time, you know people are not so keen on just seeing Alex or the agent, They're more interested in seeing a beautiful home in their area. Whether that's your listing or a listing that sold two years ago that you love I Think you can take advantage of this and put it out there on your social and and speak to it whether it's hey, we've just sold this home and here it is here: the sale price. Here's some images or hey, he's one of my favorite homes in this area. It sold three years ago for two million I Love this home because of this, this and this and you have a beautiful image. You put that on your social and you boost that ad. You sponsor that ad. I find that gets the best level of Engagement and following Beyond any content I can put out myself I Think it's also important Tom that you have a little bit of content about who you are because they want to get to know you. Most people are buying you as an agent before they actually get you in their home. They've made a decision for sort of a great degree before they actually meet the agent. Because they've done their research, they've looked you up online. they've looked at your social. They sort of get a sense of who you are and what you're personality is. So we've got to be really cautious on the messaging. You know the words that we use, what we put out there. It's for me, there's a lot of cringe in in real estate social that I think the consumer doesn't sort of look at fondly. Um, you know when if the agents show Pony like here's my new BMW or a Rolex watch that stuff is not going to help anybody. So for me, it's got to be. You've got to look at yourself as the communicator of intelligent information on a consistent basis. So you are the source that's going to give that consumer that Community the information they need. For example, if there's a development happening in the area, a new block of Apartments you can put some details out on social and say hey guys, this has been approved. It's 10 stories. There's going to be 22 bedrooms, 33 bedrooms. Whatever it might be be the communicator of intelligent information on a consistent basis. You become the source. Everyone looks at you like you're the up. You're the sort of the guy that knows what's happening in their area and you get on their shopping list. Another smart way of social content is look at some of the businesses in your community. Is there a florist? Is there a fruit shop owner? Is there a butcher? You can go and interview them, do a one minute video two minute video and say hi John What made you start your business here? Why did you choose this area and and talk to John and get some history about him, his family, his children and put that out of ad on social sponsor that geographically in that area and it's amazing the cut through you get with that I mean I'll put that in my market reports in a section called we Love Local where I interview some business owners, get a photo taken with them and there's a question questions based interview and they sort of open up about some of their history, their family, where they live, their children, schools that they went to and it's amazing. The connection that you will build with your community through this business owner. I mean they're the sort of Middle Ground person that connects you and the consumer because that that person that lives in that Community knows the butcher, knows the florist, but doesn't know this information about them. So they go and speak with them. They see this content they go in and say oh, John I Noticed that your kids were brought up here or you went to this school when you were younger. So did we. Um, so you sort of connect yourself with community in a very for me effective way by just interviewing and and spending time with these business owners so that that level of content I think is very powerful as well. Brilliant! Brian Spot on. We've seen this big trend of Agents certainly over the last couple years. Um, creating more and more content that is helping them stand out. But then I remind them the one thing that consumers want to see is houses. They want to see houses houses, so more video of houses, even more videos of housing tours. Every time they do that, they get an unbelievable response. So spot on. Let's go to number three and let's talk about unique factors. You've talked a lot about it already. There's been certainly a number of different points that you brought up that make you that expert if you had to. If you had to add a layer or two, what else have you done that just makes you the market of one the obvious choice I Think agents need to upskill in this industry? Um, you know the old approach of just being really casual and just knowing the basics. That might get you over the line in some cases. But but for me, it's not the right method of building a big business. How do you upskill if you want to be a trusted advisor which for me is the most effective way of building this, This business is becoming the source of information. You've got to know your stuff, You've got to know the pricing, how to price a home, what's sold in your area. I Think you've got had a bit of economic information and information and knowledge. You know? Let's talk about the let's talk about inflation. Let's talk about interest rates. You know what's the FED doing at the moment? What's the latest comments by Cal Those sort of things relate to real estate. but when you can articulate that intelligently, sit in front of someone and talk about things Beyond real estate that have an impact like the economy like the equities market and how that correlates the real estate values. I Think the audience, the person that's that's thinking about choosing, you will look at you as a much higher I Guess um, a better option. Let's call it than anyone else because the Casual way of just going in and being sort of cruisy. Oh yeah, that one sold for this and that one's all for that. I Don't think it's as effective I Think we need to have more intelligent conversations and get really hyper skilled around the economy. What's going on in the backdrop? Those things I think will build your profile. and when you can build that to be the trusted advisor, people will listen to you. So when you say to them I don't think you should do this. You should do that. But I think Okay, well I'll listen to him because it sounds like he knows what he's talking about. So I think these days the agent needs to be a bit more holistic. It's not just real estate. There's a lot of other details in the backdrop economically that need to be sort of intertwined into into this industry. So for me, upskilling is is really vital and I want to be that person I want to be the person that has the knowledge that I can sort of share with them as to what's going on in the community but also what's going on in in the market because that's what everyone asks you. You know what's the main question We get asked what's happening in the market Alex Um, yeah. and and you can't get the vanilla response. It's got to be a bit more intelligent. and we've got to talk about rates. We've got to talk about inflation. We've got to talk about cycles and educate the consumer. because ultimately, that's what's going to build that. That profile 100 I Love it. I Love it. So let's let's finish with team and Support. So at what point in your career did you say I need help? and what were some of those moves and then and then what does the team look like today? Tom I I was too too slow to get help you know I thought I could do this on my own for so long I just didn't see the benefit of putting someone on. But once again, in this industry in real estate, real estate agents have a hesitation to spend money. They don't want to invest in their business whereas if you and I went and opened up a coffee shop or a cafe, you know we're going to spend 200 000 on a bid out. We're going to be working three years selling four dollar cups of coffee to make our money back, whereas in real estate you could put in 20K and triple your money in a year and people are still hesitant to do that. So the mindset had to change as soon as I put a person on and I put an admin person on that was just helping me with marketing material contracts. the non-dollar productive stuff. There was no sort of face-to-face interactions or sort of I guess dialogue with the consumer. it was just back-end admin and that changed my career within three or four months. I mean that sort of read me out to do what I needed to do. and since then then, the way I've structured my business is once I had dominant market share in that specific Community then I scaled it with the help of team members. So I looked at the neighboring area or suburb or community and I got an agency as my co-agent to help build our business in that area. So their job was to generate leads, knock on doors, make calls, start to connect with the community, and get me in the door so we can go in together for the meeting, and secure the business. So that's sort of in terms of process. For me, that's the most effective way of building an attraction business. The geographic dominant business is one that is self-fulfilling It snowballs, the neighbors see the sign boards, they've talked to each other and you become very visible and that just brings in more opportunity. So our team structure now is myself. I've got three other full-time agents that are sales agents, and I've got one admin person who looks after all the back-end stuff. We've just hired a new agent, so now we're a growing team and they been designated a new geographic area. So all we're doing is we're scaling the same business model in neighboring communities with the help of team members and in terms of numbers. Last Financial year we wrote just over 10 million in commission Australian dollars which in US Dollars would be about 7 million and this year we're on track to do similar numbers. although it's a little bit slower. We've started to build our business geographically to make up for that. solar. Market Listen US Dollars Aussie dollars It doesn't matter, it's wherever you live. So 10 million is that is the number Alex that I see today as the new Benchmark I Can remember you know having done this now for 33 years but it was a big deal when an agent made a million dollars and then it was two million dollars and it was 5 million and now having a few clients that are making 20 22, 24 million dollars in commissions. Yes, they have a team but clearly you've raised the bar. You've set the standard. So there's a guy I Want to introduce you to just kind of random thought here as we're doing this podcast Dave Robles spent a long time client of ours from Los Angeles you and he have a similar model. He went from Expert trying to be everywhere to Expert 2 800 home subdivision where he lives and he is the dominant force. And picture this: Alex He now has 20 other team members doing the same exact process in their subdivisions and and basically he helps orchestrate making them the local celebrity, the agent of choice, the market of one in their area. So as you're progressing I Can't wait to introduce you because the two of you two are just you would. You would share so many success stories of what it means to be that local expert and then how do you expand that right with him? He has 20 and he's told me he's like I Can imagine having a hundred people like this and literally taking over a piece of the valley of Los Angeles which is a huge territory. So I think you're right. You're right on track my friend. Wow, that's awesome! Tom Yeah I Found that around 2 000 homes is an easy number to service. Once you get up to like 10 20 000 I think it's hard to be consistent. good quality content Frequently 2000 is about The Sweet Spot I think and then once you can scale that with the help of team members I mean to your point with with this gentleman that's dominating his Market That's a massive business like 20 28. It shows the power of the business model. It works, it works. Bingo Your model is spot on. So Alex this has been so enjoyable and you've you've shared so many insights. If somebody wanted to reach out to you, what's the best way for them to connect with you, should they hit you up on Instagram Should they hit you up on email? What's the best way if they wanted to ask a few questions? I'm on Instagram my pages Alex Jordan McGraw I'm on Facebook either Instagram Facebook Email is Alex Jordan Mcgrath.com but however, I can assist I'm very open to having those conversations with you with your team. Outstanding! Well thank you so much for being on the show today and congratulations on your tremendous success! I Can't wait to see you down in! Australia in May Uh, it's gonna be. It's the 25 year anniversary so I'm assuming you're going to be there as well. It's going to be a wonderful two-day event I Look forward to it Tom it's been a privilege. Thanks for having me thank you so much and for my friend listening. Make sure you follow my social channels watch what this guy's doing. Clearly he was referred to me by a dear friend I've known for a couple decades who said this guy is a star and you just heard exactly why I wanted him on the show. So Alex thank you again and we'll see you soon and for my friend watching, maybe share this with a friend. especially that maybe they're in a rocky place where right now in their career maybe as Alex did they've hit the wall and they're looking for what's that next? Direction and maybe just maybe you sending them this podcast could be that moment where 12 years from now we look back and say it was that Alex podcast I listened to. That was the beginning so thank you my friend. I Appreciate you and I'll see you soon. Take care Foreign.